The time has come, the walrus said,

On Mar 21, 7:10*pm, Giles wrote:

You've done a good job of describing the barber chair phenomenon. As
you have learned, a dangerous situation exists anytime one is cutting
a tree, log, or even a branch that is under tension. Binding the butt
of the tree can prevent most barber chair accidents, but just as you
wouldn't knowingly place yourself in line with the muzzle of a firearm
just because the safety is engaged, you should never place yourself
(or any part of your body) in a direct line with the direction of
tension.

Bob Weinberger - DuPont,WA

Giles wrote in
:

On Mar 21, 8:02*pm, "dr.narcolepsy" wrote:
On Mar 21, 8:45*pm, Bob wrote:





On Mar 19, 4:29*am, Giles wrote:

On Mar 19, 3:12*am, Bob wrote:

Actually the type of accident you describe (here in big timber
coun
try
we call it a barber chair) is *one of the most common causes of
d
eath
or serious injury in timber falling accidents.

Never heard the term "barber chair" before in this context. *Easy
enough to understand, though. *It's also easy to believe that it
ra
nks
high as a cause of death or injury. *Do you have ready access to
an
y
numbers?

*Many years ago when I was involved in logging supervision, I used
to receive regular accident reports from Oregon OSHA on serious
logging accidents. *Death & serious injury from barber chairs were
always hig
h
on the list. *I imagine OSHA still keeps such statistics.

Many
(including Birch) are quite prone to splitting as you described
sometime during the back cut - especially if they have a heavy
lean
.

I've seen it happen a couple of times myself. *Didn't know that
bir
ch
was a frequent offender.

Though many saw hands scoff at the practice as being sissy, the
saf
est
way to fell such trees is to bind the butt (immediately above
where the top of the notch cut will be) with heavy duty nylon
webbing (ma
de
to handle the extreme forces involved) before starting any
cuts.

This, too, is news to me. *I'd appreciate any more inofrmation
you could provide as I'll be doing a lot of cutting here in the
next few months.

I probably should have used the term strapping rather then webbing.
The type of nylon web strap that log truck drivers in many areas
use to bind down their loads is what is used. Any good saw shop in
an area where there is much commercial logging going on could make
one up for you in a size to handle the size trees you will be
working with. *It should be used on any tree with a very heavy lean
(especially hardwoods) or one with a very unbalanced crown (heavy
in the direction of fall).

The
old saying that "There are bold timber fallers and there are
old timber fallers, but few are lucky enough to be old bold
timber fallers." is quite true.

There have been times and arenas in life when I've flirted with
the bold thing. *I was lucky. *I try hard not to do that anymore.
*
Never
did it in connection with tree falling. *But, like just about
anyon
e,
I suppose, I've been careless on occasion. *I don't think Karl
was particularly bold.....and he was certainly getting old at 69.
*He m
ay
or may not have been careless.....I don't know whether he had
ever heard of the practice of binding trees with webbing.

At any rate, it now looks as if this "bad luck" may have been
preventable. *Casts the whole mess in a different light.

Much to think about.

Thanks, Bob

giles

Bob Weinberger * *DuPont, WA

Hi, everyone. *Wolfgang - thanks for that story, entertaining and
thought provoking, as always. *And thanks, Bob, too, for sharing from
your expertise.

Please forgive this question - I'm not too embarrassed to say that I
don't quite get the mechanics of this accident.

google image search of "logging accident barber chair" produced
this:http
://www.forestryforum.com/images/YaBBImages/userpics/barberchair.jpg

Is the issue that part of the tree from *below* the intended cut gets
split along with the main part of the tree and that's what swings up
with bad potential results?

I can't speak with any authority to what happens generally, but in
Karl's case, and as I have seen before, the split occurs (or, starts,
anyway) right at the place where the back cut is made. The
illustration at the site you pointed us to is a bit misleading in that
it doesn't show the notch, which is precisely opposite where the split
has occured and where the sawyer has met his doom. Of course, the
result shown can also happen without a notch having been cut at all
(as shown) but common practice, as far as I know, includes notching on
the side toward which the tree is intended to fall. However, this may
indeed not be the case where trees lean severely and where they are
intended to fall in the direction of the lean. Obviously, cutting
opposite this direction will produce the intended result without a
notch.....but the possible consequences (with or without the notch,
for all I know) are now all too obvious.

In any case, the answer to your question would appear to be no.....the
split starts at the backcut and moves up through the trunk.....or so
it has always been in my admittedly limited experience.

Incidentally, I've seen in happen even with small trees and without
any significant lean. And, unlike what is shown in the illustration,
the busted end does not necessarily always simply lever up. It will
often kcik back as well. Imagine the broken end actually moving
toward the sawyer so that even if he were standing several feet back
from where he is shown in the illustration. Depending on
circumstances, he might still be toast.

And, of course, it is not just whole standing trees that are
dangerous. I narrowly missed being decapitated myself by a four inch
cherry branch last spring. The tree was already down......dropped by
a much larger oak that took several other trees with it. The cherry
branch was obviously under tension.....had a significant bend to it.
I misjudged the angle of the bend or the forces at play or one thing
or another. I cut it and felt the wind whizzing past my left ear
before the import of what had just happened (or not.....depending on
point of view.....I'm glad to report that I'm in a position to take
the latter) registered in my brain or Becky's; she was about fifteen
feet away, waiting to load up the sawn firewood.

Any way you look at it, wherever the sound of a chainsaw penetrates
(or any other saw) there is danger aplenty.

But then, the same can be said for any place that such sounds never
reach.

giles
who has known all his life (on a more or less intellectual level) that
one way or another they WILL get you in the end. it's just in the
past few decades that a more personal and visceral point of view has
come to hold sway.

p.s. Karl died about 2 or 3 a.m. on saturday.


WTF does this irrelevant babbling about felling a MF-Tree have to do with
FISHING?????

I know, It's the 'old woman' in you that just can't resist the opportunity
to go on, and on, about a nothing topic. All you need, you Old Bitch, is
just the least bit of an chance to start up that super charged motor mouth
of yours, and spew out from here to eternity!

Babble on you crusty old witch!!

On Mar 21, 9:17*pm, ConwayRadis wrote:
Giles wrote :



On Mar 21, 8:02*pm, "dr.narcolepsy" wrote:
On Mar 21, 8:45*pm, Bob wrote:

On Mar 19, 4:29*am, Giles wrote:

On Mar 19, 3:12*am, Bob wrote:

Actually the type of accident you describe (here in big timber
coun
try
we call it a barber chair) is *one of the most common causes of
d
eath
or serious injury in timber falling accidents.

Never heard the term "barber chair" before in this context. *Easy
enough to understand, though. *It's also easy to believe that it
ra
nks
high as a cause of death or injury. *Do you have ready access to
an
y
numbers?

*Many years ago when I was involved in logging supervision, I used
to receive regular accident reports from Oregon OSHA on serious
logging accidents. *Death & serious injury from barber chairs were
always hig
h
on the list. *I imagine OSHA still keeps such statistics.

Many
(including Birch) are quite prone to splitting as you described
sometime during the back cut - especially if they have a heavy
lean
.

I've seen it happen a couple of times myself. *Didn't know that
bir
ch
was a frequent offender.

Though many saw hands scoff at the practice as being sissy, the
saf
est
way to fell such trees is to bind the butt (immediately above
where the top of the notch cut will be) with heavy duty nylon
webbing (ma
de
to handle the extreme forces involved) before starting any
cuts.

This, too, is news to me. *I'd appreciate any more inofrmation
you could provide as I'll be doing a lot of cutting here in the
next few months.

I probably should have used the term strapping rather then webbing.
The type of nylon web strap that log truck drivers in many areas
use to bind down their loads is what is used. Any good saw shop in
an area where there is much commercial logging going on could make
one up for you in a size to handle the size trees you will be
working with. *It should be used on any tree with a very heavy lean
(especially hardwoods) or one with a very unbalanced crown (heavy
in the direction of fall).

The
old saying that "There are bold timber fallers and there are
old timber fallers, but few are lucky enough to be old bold
timber fallers." is quite true.

There have been times and arenas in life when I've flirted with
the bold thing. *I was lucky. *I try hard not to do that anymore.
*
Never
did it in connection with tree falling. *But, like just about
anyon
e,
I suppose, I've been careless on occasion. *I don't think Karl
was particularly bold.....and he was certainly getting old at 69.
*He m
ay
or may not have been careless.....I don't know whether he had
ever heard of the practice of binding trees with webbing.

At any rate, it now looks as if this "bad luck" may have been
preventable. *Casts the whole mess in a different light.

Much to think about.

Thanks, Bob

giles

Bob Weinberger * *DuPont, WA

Hi, everyone. *Wolfgang - thanks for that story, entertaining and
thought provoking, as always. *And thanks, Bob, too, for sharing from
your expertise.

Please forgive this question - I'm not too embarrassed to say that I
don't quite get the mechanics of this accident.

google image search of "logging accident barber chair" produced
this:http
://www.forestryforum.com/images/YaBBImages/userpics/barberchair.jpg

Is the issue that part of the tree from *below* the intended cut gets
split along with the main part of the tree and that's what swings up
with bad potential results?

I can't speak with any authority to what happens generally, but in
Karl's case, and as I have seen before, the split occurs (or, starts,
anyway) right at the place *where the back cut is made. *The
illustration at the site you pointed us to is a bit misleading in that
it doesn't show the notch, which is precisely opposite where the split
has occured and where the sawyer has met his doom. *Of course, the
result shown can also happen without a notch having been cut at all
(as shown) but common practice, as far as I know, includes notching on
the side toward which the tree is intended to fall. *However, this may
indeed not be the case where trees lean severely and where they are
intended to fall in the direction of the lean. *Obviously, cutting
opposite this direction will produce the intended result without a
notch.....but the possible consequences (with or without the notch,
for all I know) are now all too obvious.

In any case, the answer to your question would appear to be no.....the
split starts at the backcut and moves up through the trunk.....or so
it has always been in my admittedly limited experience.

Incidentally, I've seen in happen even with small trees and without
any significant lean. *And, unlike what is shown in the illustration,
the busted end does not necessarily always simply lever up. *It will
often kcik back as well. *Imagine the broken end actually moving
toward the sawyer so that even if he were standing several feet back
from where he is shown in the illustration. *Depending on
circumstances, he might still be toast.

And, of course, it is not just whole standing trees that are
dangerous. *I narrowly missed being decapitated myself by a four inch
cherry branch last spring. *The tree was already down......dropped by
a much larger oak that took several other trees with it. *The cherry
branch was obviously under tension.....had a significant bend to it.
I misjudged the angle of the bend or the forces at play or one thing
or another. *I cut it and felt the wind whizzing past my left ear
before the import of what had just happened (or not.....depending on
point of view.....I'm glad to report that I'm in a position to take
the latter) registered in my brain or Becky's; she was about fifteen
feet away, waiting to load up the sawn firewood.

Any way you look at it, wherever the sound of a chainsaw penetrates
(or any other saw) there is danger aplenty.

But then, the same can be said for any place that such sounds never
reach.

giles
who has known all his life (on a more or less intellectual level) that
one way or another they WILL get you in the end. *it's just in the
past few decades that a more personal and visceral point of view has
come to hold sway. * * * *

p.s. *Karl died about 2 or 3 a.m. on saturday.

WTF *does this irrelevant babbling about felling a MF-Tree have to do with
FISHING?????

I know, It's the 'old woman' in you that just can't resist the opportunity
to go on, and on, about a nothing topic. *All you need, you Old Bitch, is
just the least bit of an chance to start up that super charged motor mouth
of yours, and spew out from here to eternity!

Babble on you crusty old witch!!

And just what does your complaining about the thread have to do with
FISHING???

On Mar 21, 11:17*pm, ConwayRadis wrote:

WTF *does this irrelevant babbling about felling a MF-Tree have to do with
FISHING?????

I know, It's the 'old woman' in you that just can't resist the opportunity
to go on, and on, about a nothing topic. *All you need, you Old Bitch, is
just the least bit of an chance to start up that super charged motor mouth
of yours, and spew out from here to eternity!

Babble on you crusty old witch!!

Some interesting questions and observations there. And I'm sure that
we could collectively address them satisfactorily if you would give us
an idea of why it hurts so much to be you. I mean, we already know
that it's not simply rank stupidity. We see enough of that here just
about every day to know that its possessors, though intellectually and
morally crippled, nevertheless manage to get through most days without
doing themselves any obvious debilitating damage. Not to say that
they don't suffer from obvious debilitating damage.....but we rarely
see any incremental increase in that damage on any given day. Well,
o.k., it isn't exactly "rarely," but you know what I mean.

So, what is it? Do you have disgusting habits that you simply cannot
give up despite knowing that the world disapproves? Do you have
thoughts and desires that would cause family and neighbors to stone
you to death if you ever gave vent to them? Is it guilt over heinous
acts committed in childhood.....or well into whatever semblance of
adulthood an overly generous observer might be willing to ascribe to
you? Are you utterly incapable of face to face encounters with human
beings? Are you paralyzed by fear at the mere thought of engaging in
something as portentous as idle chatter? Are you possessed of a
visage that sends women and small children shrieking into the cold
dark night? Do you eat boogers? Do you carry your bottle-cap
collection in your anus?

Give us just a few little hints. We'll see what we can do for you.

g.

Giles wrote in
:

On Mar 21, 11:17*pm, ConwayRadis wrote:

WTF *does this irrelevant babbling about felling a MF-Tree have to do
w
ith
FISHING?????

I know, It's the 'old woman' in you that just can't resist the
opportunit
y
to go on, and on, about a nothing topic. *All you need, you Old
Bitch,
is
just the least bit of an chance to start up that super charged motor
mout
h
of yours, and spew out from here to eternity!

Babble on you crusty old witch!!

Some interesting questions and observations there. And I'm sure that
we could collectively address them satisfactorily if you would give us
an idea of why it hurts so much to be you. I mean, we already know
that it's not simply rank stupidity. We see enough of that here just
about every day to know that its possessors, though intellectually and
morally crippled, nevertheless manage to get through most days without
doing themselves any obvious debilitating damage. Not to say that
they don't suffer from obvious debilitating damage.....but we rarely
see any incremental increase in that damage on any given day. Well,
o.k., it isn't exactly "rarely," but you know what I mean.

So, what is it? Do you have disgusting habits that you simply cannot
give up despite knowing that the world disapproves? Do you have
thoughts and desires that would cause family and neighbors to stone
you to death if you ever gave vent to them? Is it guilt over heinous
acts committed in childhood.....or well into whatever semblance of
adulthood an overly generous observer might be willing to ascribe to
you? Are you utterly incapable of face to face encounters with human
beings? Are you paralyzed by fear at the mere thought of engaging in
something as portentous as idle chatter? Are you possessed of a
visage that sends women and small children shrieking into the cold
dark night? Do you eat boogers? Do you carry your bottle-cap
collection in your anus?

Give us just a few little hints. We'll see what we can do for you.

g.


GOOD GOD!!!!

Yet another babbling crusty old bitch that goes on, and on, and on about
irrelevent BS that has nothing to do with FISHING!!!!!

Babble on senile old woman!

On Mar 22, 7:37*pm, ConwayRadis wrote:
Giles wrote :



On Mar 21, 11:17*pm, ConwayRadis wrote:

GOOD GOD!!!!

Yet another babbling crusty old bitch that goes on, and on, and on about
irrelevent BS that has nothing to do with FISHING!!!!!

Babble on senile old woman!

Any rational person would find it more than a little ironic that you,
who has not contributed one post about fishing (at least under your
current nom de plume), complains about posts that are not about
fishing.

On Mar 22, 9:37*pm, ConwayRadis wrote:
Giles wrote :





On Mar 21, 11:17*pm, ConwayRadis wrote:

WTF *does this irrelevant babbling about felling a MF-Tree have to do
w
ith
FISHING?????

I know, It's the 'old woman' in you that just can't resist the
opportunit
y
to go on, and on, about a nothing topic. *All you need, you Old
Bitch,
is
just the least bit of an chance to start up that super charged motor
mout
h
of yours, and spew out from here to eternity!

Babble on you crusty old witch!!

Some interesting questions and observations there. *And I'm sure that
we could collectively address them satisfactorily if you would give us
an idea of why it hurts so much to be you. *I mean, we already know
that it's not simply rank stupidity. *We see enough of that here just
about every day to know that its possessors, though intellectually and
morally crippled, nevertheless manage to get through most days without
doing themselves any obvious debilitating damage. *Not to say that
they don't suffer from obvious debilitating damage.....but we rarely
see any incremental increase in that damage on any given day. *Well,
o.k., it isn't exactly "rarely," but you know what I mean.

So, what is it? *Do you have disgusting habits that you simply cannot
give up despite knowing that the world disapproves? *Do you have
thoughts and desires that would cause family and neighbors to stone
you to death if you ever gave vent to them? *Is it guilt over heinous
acts committed in childhood.....or well into whatever semblance of
adulthood an overly generous observer might be willing to ascribe to
you? *Are you utterly incapable of face to face encounters with human
beings? *Are you paralyzed by fear at the mere thought of engaging in
something as portentous as idle chatter? *Are you possessed of a
visage that sends women and small children shrieking into the cold
dark night? *Do you eat boogers? *Do you carry your bottle-cap
collection in your anus?

Give us just a few little hints. *We'll see what we can do for you.

g.

GOOD GOD!!!!

Yet another babbling crusty old bitch that goes on, and on, and on about
irrelevent BS that has nothing to do with FISHING!!!!!

Another?

Hm.....

Exactly how many of us am I?

Not that it matters much in terms of overall content, but we like to
keep an accurate score.

Babble on senile old woman!

Oh.....whew!....for a moment there we thought you wanted us to cease.

Well then.....um.....let's see now.....oh yes, I believe we were
discussing your pain. You have doubtless wondered from time to time
as to its ultimate origin. Invoking he widely useful paradigm of the
path of least resistance (or Occam's razor, if you prefer) I'd suggest
that you consider Karma, which is to say that you just plain deserve
it.

In any case, there's nothing you can do about. It's going to be with
you for as long as you live. Well, actually, that observation DOES
suggest a simple, foolproof and permanent remedy.

Good luck!

g.

On Mar 22, 9:02*am, "dr.narcolepsy" wrote:
On Mar 21, 8:45*pm, Bob wrote:





On Mar 19, 4:29*am, Giles wrote:

On Mar 19, 3:12*am, Bob wrote:

Actually the type of accident you describe (here in big timber country
we call it a barber chair) is *one of the most common causes of death
or serious injury in timber falling accidents.

Never heard the term "barber chair" before in this context. *Easy
enough to understand, though. *It's also easy to believe that it ranks
high as a cause of death or injury. *Do you have ready access to any
numbers?

*Many years ago when I was involved in logging supervision, I used to
receive regular accident reports from Oregon OSHA on serious logging
accidents. *Death & serious injury from barber chairs were always high
on the list. *I imagine OSHA still keeps such statistics.

Many
(including Birch) are quite prone to splitting as you described
sometime during the back cut - especially if they have a heavy lean..

I've seen it happen a couple of times myself. *Didn't know that birch
was a frequent offender.

Though many saw hands scoff at the practice as being sissy, the safest
way to fell such trees is to bind the butt (immediately above where
the top of the notch cut will be) with heavy duty nylon webbing (made
to handle the extreme forces involved) before starting any cuts.

This, too, is news to me. *I'd appreciate any more inofrmation you
could provide as I'll be doing a lot of cutting here in the next few
months.

I probably should have used the term strapping rather then webbing.
The type of nylon web strap that log truck drivers in many areas use
to bind down their loads is what is used. Any good saw shop in an area
where there is much commercial logging going on could make one up for
you in a size to handle the size trees you will be working with. *It
should be used on any tree with a very heavy lean (especially
hardwoods) or one with a very unbalanced crown (heavy in the direction
of fall).

The
old saying that "There are bold timber fallers and there are old
timber fallers, but few are lucky enough to be old bold timber
fallers." is quite true.

There have been times and arenas in life when I've flirted with the
bold thing. *I was lucky. *I try hard not to do that anymore. *Never
did it in connection with tree falling. *But, like just about anyone,
I suppose, I've been careless on occasion. *I don't think Karl was
particularly bold.....and he was certainly getting old at 69. *He may
or may not have been careless.....I don't know whether he had ever
heard of the practice of binding trees with webbing.

At any rate, it now looks as if this "bad luck" may have been
preventable. *Casts the whole mess in a different light.

Much to think about.

Thanks, Bob

giles

Bob Weinberger * *DuPont, WA

Hi, everyone. *Wolfgang - thanks for that story, entertaining and
thought provoking, as always. *And thanks, Bob, too, for sharing from
your expertise.

Please forgive this question - I'm not too embarrassed to say that I
don't quite get the mechanics of this accident.

google image search of "logging accident barber chair" produced this:http://www.forestryforum.com/images/...arberchair.jpg

Is the issue that part of the tree from *below* the intended cut gets
split along with the main part of the tree and that's what swings up
with bad potential results?

There's also this youTube movie
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YAf6...eature=related

You can see the other problem with a barber chair (other than the
potential of getting hammered by the snapping butt); you lose control
of where the tree falls. It can be hard to get out of the way of a 70
foot tree unless you can run 70 feet in under a second.

On Mar 23, 9:07*am, Myron Buck wrote:
On Mar 22, 9:02*am, "dr.narcolepsy" wrote:





On Mar 21, 8:45*pm, Bob wrote:

On Mar 19, 4:29*am, Giles wrote:

On Mar 19, 3:12*am, Bob wrote:

Actually the type of accident you describe (here in big timber country
we call it a barber chair) is *one of the most common causes of death
or serious injury in timber falling accidents.

Never heard the term "barber chair" before in this context. *Easy
enough to understand, though. *It's also easy to believe that it ranks
high as a cause of death or injury. *Do you have ready access to any
numbers?

*Many years ago when I was involved in logging supervision, I used to
receive regular accident reports from Oregon OSHA on serious logging
accidents. *Death & serious injury from barber chairs were always high
on the list. *I imagine OSHA still keeps such statistics.

Many
(including Birch) are quite prone to splitting as you described
sometime during the back cut - especially if they have a heavy lean.

I've seen it happen a couple of times myself. *Didn't know that birch
was a frequent offender.

Though many saw hands scoff at the practice as being sissy, the safest
way to fell such trees is to bind the butt (immediately above where
the top of the notch cut will be) with heavy duty nylon webbing (made
to handle the extreme forces involved) before starting any cuts.

This, too, is news to me. *I'd appreciate any more inofrmation you
could provide as I'll be doing a lot of cutting here in the next few
months.

I probably should have used the term strapping rather then webbing.
The type of nylon web strap that log truck drivers in many areas use
to bind down their loads is what is used. Any good saw shop in an area
where there is much commercial logging going on could make one up for
you in a size to handle the size trees you will be working with. *It
should be used on any tree with a very heavy lean (especially
hardwoods) or one with a very unbalanced crown (heavy in the direction
of fall).

The
old saying that "There are bold timber fallers and there are old
timber fallers, but few are lucky enough to be old bold timber
fallers." is quite true.

There have been times and arenas in life when I've flirted with the
bold thing. *I was lucky. *I try hard not to do that anymore. *Never
did it in connection with tree falling. *But, like just about anyone,
I suppose, I've been careless on occasion. *I don't think Karl was
particularly bold.....and he was certainly getting old at 69. *He may
or may not have been careless.....I don't know whether he had ever
heard of the practice of binding trees with webbing.

At any rate, it now looks as if this "bad luck" may have been
preventable. *Casts the whole mess in a different light.

Much to think about.

Thanks, Bob

giles

Bob Weinberger * *DuPont, WA

Hi, everyone. *Wolfgang - thanks for that story, entertaining and
thought provoking, as always. *And thanks, Bob, too, for sharing from
your expertise.

Please forgive this question - I'm not too embarrassed to say that I
don't quite get the mechanics of this accident.

google image search of "logging accident barber chair" produced this:http://www.forestryforum.com/images/...arberchair.jpg

Is the issue that part of the tree from *below* the intended cut gets
split along with the main part of the tree and that's what swings up
with bad potential results?

There's also this youTube moviehttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YAf61zz5VU&feature=related

You can see the other problem with a barber chair (other than the
potential of getting hammered by the snapping butt); you lose control
of where the tree falls. It can be hard to get out of the way of a 70
foot tree unless you can run 70 feet in under a second.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Well, I was once around munitions that were trying to cook off (catch
fire). Found out how incredibly fast a person can run over broken
ground. Don't really remember running, I do remember looking back and
noticing how far away the fire had gotten. So, 70' in a second...
yeah, got it covered.
Frank Reid

On Mar 23, 1:22*pm, Frank Reid © 2010 wrote:

.....70' in a second...yeah, got it covered.
Frank Reid

Um.....having read numerous accounts of (as well as personally
witnessing) events in which speeds of nearly 7 feet per second were
called for (and even accomplished.....occasionally) one is tempted to
ask, yeah, but what about collateral damage?

giles
who, in rare moments of wakefulness, has seen our esteemed colleague
sustain significant damage from projectiles moving at speeds nearing
the plate tectonical..