OT Food for thought

On Sat, 28 Feb 2004 19:38:40 -0700, rw
wrote:

Peter Charles wrote:

He is serious - have you forgotten mad cow?

Bad example, Peter.

Why? Explain

Peter

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Peter Charles wrote:

On Sat, 28 Feb 2004 19:38:40 -0700, rw
wrote:


Peter Charles wrote:

He is serious - have you forgotten mad cow?

Bad example, Peter.


Why? Explain

It's my understanding that genetic tests and records revealed that the
BSE-infected cow that was found in the US came from Canada.

Is the Canadian media reporting something different? If so, I'd like to
hear about it. I'm serious. I know the Canadian government objected to
the initial report as "premature," but AFAIK they haven't been defending
that position.

When this news came out, there was no anti-Canada sentiment in the US
that I ever heard, and some of my friends are cattle ranchers. It was
just one of those things.

--
Cut "to the chase" for my email address.

On Sat, 28 Feb 2004 20:46:29 -0700, rw
wrote:

Peter Charles wrote:

On Sat, 28 Feb 2004 19:38:40 -0700, rw
wrote:


Peter Charles wrote:

He is serious - have you forgotten mad cow?

Bad example, Peter.


Why? Explain

It's my understanding that genetic tests and records revealed that the
BSE-infected cow that was found in the US came from Canada.

Is the Canadian media reporting something different? If so, I'd like to
hear about it. I'm serious. I know the Canadian government objected to
the initial report as "premature," but AFAIK they haven't been defending
that position.

When this news came out, there was no anti-Canada sentiment in the US
that I ever heard, and some of my friends are cattle ranchers. It was
just one of those things.

No, the Canadian media did not report anything differently. However,
almost every CNN, NBC, etc. newscast on the subject went on and on
about this being a Canadian cow with the strong implication that the
US cattle industry was not to blame. You have probably heard that
Canada has had a recent case of mad cow disease that predates this
case and that the US closed its borders to Canadian beef as a result.
Did you also know that this cow origniated from a US herd? I suppose
CNN etc. left out that detail. Contrary to the CNN etc. coverage of
the US case, the Canadian media did not blame the US for our mad cow
case.



Peter

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Peter Charles wrote:

No, the Canadian media did not report anything differently. However,
almost every CNN, NBC, etc. newscast on the subject went on and on
about this being a Canadian cow with the strong implication that the
US cattle industry was not to blame. You have probably heard that
Canada has had a recent case of mad cow disease that predates this
case and that the US closed its borders to Canadian beef as a result.
Did you also know that this cow origniated from a US herd? I suppose
CNN etc. left out that detail. Contrary to the CNN etc. coverage of
the US case, the Canadian media did not blame the US for our mad cow
case.

Let me get this straight. You're saying that what you see on CNN, NBC,
etc. proves an anti-Canadian bias in America. Is that accurate?

My take is that the country of origin was a very important angle in the
recent BSE incident. Should that information have been suppressed?

Maybe you should tune into CBC occasionally.

Please believe me about this, Peter. Americans, by and large, are not
anti-Canadian. You are well below the radar. I think that's the real
problem that some Canadians have with America.

--
Cut "to the chase" for my email address.

rw wrote:
Please believe me about this, Peter. Americans, by and large, are not
anti-Canadian. You are well below the radar. I think that's the real
problem that some Canadians have with America.

With respect to mad-cow disease, the real issue is not country of
origin, but the length of the US embargo against Canadian beef. Beef
imports into the US from Canada have been a long-standing issue between
the US and Canada. Before BSE, Canada shipped billions of $$ worth of
cattle to the US. For years, the US accussed Canada of unfair trade
practices, and at one time, placed a tarrif on incoming beef from
Canada. This was eventually overturned, but the issue remained. When
Canada had its one case of BSE, the US was the first to ban Canadian
beef. Canada did everything, and more, to demonstrate that the case was
isolated. Thousands of animals were slaughtered, and no other case was
found. The US has refused to lift its embargo on Canadian beef, even
though all the surveillance requirements were satisfied. The US is on
record as saying it will not lift the embargo until Canada addresses the
other issues that the US considers as unfair trading practice. The issue
has moved from science and food safety to politics, olitics that reflect
the anti-Canadian bias of your government. As a result, the Canadian
beef industry is suffering greatly, and rural economy in my area of the
country is also suffering. All because of long-standing US bias against
Canada.

Beleive me Steve, there is a huge anti-Canadian bias in your country. IT
has existed for years, has directly affected trade in spite of all the
free-trade agreements in place, and has been at its nadir ever since
your country appointed its current leadership. You don't see it because
of bias in your media. I have to deal with it daily.

Tim Lysyk wrote:

rw wrote:

Please believe me about this, Peter. Americans, by and large, are not
anti-Canadian. You are well below the radar. I think that's the real
problem that some Canadians have with America.


With respect to mad-cow disease, the real issue is not country of
origin, but the length of the US embargo against Canadian beef. Beef
imports into the US from Canada have been a long-standing issue between
the US and Canada. Before BSE, Canada shipped billions of $$ worth of
cattle to the US. For years, the US accussed Canada of unfair trade
practices, and at one time, placed a tarrif on incoming beef from
Canada. This was eventually overturned, but the issue remained. When
Canada had its one case of BSE, the US was the first to ban Canadian
beef. Canada did everything, and more, to demonstrate that the case was
isolated. Thousands of animals were slaughtered, and no other case was
found. The US has refused to lift its embargo on Canadian beef, even
though all the surveillance requirements were satisfied. The US is on
record as saying it will not lift the embargo until Canada addresses the
other issues that the US considers as unfair trading practice. The issue
has moved from science and food safety to politics, olitics that reflect
the anti-Canadian bias of your government. As a result, the Canadian
beef industry is suffering greatly, and rural economy in my area of the
country is also suffering. All because of long-standing US bias against
Canada.

Beleive me Steve, there is a huge anti-Canadian bias in your country. IT
has existed for years, has directly affected trade in spite of all the
free-trade agreements in place, and has been at its nadir ever since
your country appointed its current leadership. You don't see it because
of bias in your media. I have to deal with it daily.


There may very well be government bias toward Canada, however your
example and George's aren't in place "all because of long-standing US
bias against Canada." As I understand it, the Canadian government
subsidizes feedlots and the grain fed to cattle. The Canadian government
also regulates the price paid for drugs. I don't think that either of
these practices are necessarily bad, however, they do provide an unfair
playing field for American businesses competing in these fields. What
you would see as fair treatment to your country would be putting
American businesses at an unfair disadvantage.

Willi

On Sun, 29 Feb 2004 08:48:19 -0700, Willi wrote:




There may very well be government bias toward Canada, however your
example and George's aren't in place "all because of long-standing US
bias against Canada." As I understand it, the Canadian government
subsidizes feedlots and the grain fed to cattle. The Canadian government
also regulates the price paid for drugs. I don't think that either of
these practices are necessarily bad, however, they do provide an unfair
playing field for American businesses competing in these fields. What
you would see as fair treatment to your country would be putting
American businesses at an unfair disadvantage.

Willi


I'm sorry Willi, but for you to complain about real or imagined
subsidies of agriculture by foreign countries is incredibly
hypocritical considering the vast array of US agricultural subsidies
that exist. Canada is on record demanding a reduction of US and EU
agricultural subsidies but instead, we get this sort of crap over BSE.

Too bad we don't have a government with some balls . . .

Peter

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On Sun, 29 Feb 2004 08:48:19 -0700, Willi wrote:

(snipped severely)

The Canadian government
also regulates the price paid for drugs.

And the drug companies keep selling to them. I doubt they're taking a
loss on the deal.

As an aside, the FDA keeps yammering about the possible dangers of
reimportation of drugs. Huh? REimport? This implies that the drugs
are made here, sold to Canada, and then come back here. So why should
they be dangerous? Do they have special factories that sell
substandard medications to Canadians?
--

rbc:vixen,Minnow Goddess,Willow Watcher,and all that sort of thing.
Often taunted by trout.
Only a fool would refuse to believe in luck. Only a damn fool would rely on it.

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Willi wrote:

There may very well be government bias toward Canada, however your
example and George's aren't in place "all because of long-standing US
bias against Canada." As I understand it, the Canadian government
subsidizes feedlots and the grain fed to cattle.

Interesting you should say that about subsidies to the beef industry.
Kind of shows your own bias, or someone's, as there are no subsidies to
the beef industry. The Canadian government does not subsidize feedlots
nor grain fed to cattle. There really are no Canadian government
subsidies for beef cattle production. The main trade irritant before
BSE was Canada's require for disease testing for cattle coming into
Canada. The long standing bias against Canada wis not just from
government from from American farmers and other involved in the
agriculture and natural resource industry.

You are right about one thing, the difference between a competive
advantage and unfair trading practice is..."when I do it, I am
exercising a competitive advantage, when you do it, it is an unfair
subsidy."

Tim Lysyk

says...
With respect to mad-cow disease, the real issue is not country of
origin, but the length of the US embargo against Canadian beef. Beef
imports into the US from Canada have been a long-standing issue between
the US and Canada. Before BSE, Canada shipped billions of $$ worth of
cattle to the US. For years, the US accussed Canada of unfair trade
practices, and at one time, placed a tarrif on incoming beef from
Canada. This was eventually overturned, but the issue remained. When
Canada had its one case of BSE, the US was the first to ban Canadian
beef. Canada did everything, and more, to demonstrate that the case was
isolated. Thousands of animals were slaughtered, and no other case was
found. The US has refused to lift its embargo on Canadian beef, even
though all the surveillance requirements were satisfied. The US is on
record as saying it will not lift the embargo until Canada addresses the
other issues that the US considers as unfair trading practice. The issue
has moved from science and food safety to politics, olitics that reflect
the anti-Canadian bias of your government. As a result, the Canadian
beef industry is suffering greatly, and rural economy in my area of the
country is also suffering. All because of long-standing US bias against
Canada.

There are a few factual flaws in the above:
# of cases of BSE:
http://www.oie.int/eng/info/en_esbmonde.htm

Current bans:
http://www.inspection.gc.ca/english/...109ria_e.shtml
*notice that this is a CANADIAN site*

Which is actually kinda funny in a way when you consider:
http://www.bseinfo.org/
or
http://makeashorterlink.com/?W29265B57
if the first one is a little too "biased" for....

Hmmmm, I think your argument is a little off. Okay, WAY off.... The
only bad thing I can think of about Canada or Canadians is that they
whine far too much about the US. ;-)
--
Warren
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http://www.geocities.com/troutbum_mt...nConclave.html