OT Food for thought

says...
With respect to mad-cow disease, the real issue is not country of
origin, but the length of the US embargo against Canadian beef. Beef
imports into the US from Canada have been a long-standing issue between
the US and Canada. Before BSE, Canada shipped billions of $$ worth of
cattle to the US. For years, the US accussed Canada of unfair trade
practices, and at one time, placed a tarrif on incoming beef from
Canada. This was eventually overturned, but the issue remained. When
Canada had its one case of BSE, the US was the first to ban Canadian
beef. Canada did everything, and more, to demonstrate that the case was
isolated. Thousands of animals were slaughtered, and no other case was
found. The US has refused to lift its embargo on Canadian beef, even
though all the surveillance requirements were satisfied. The US is on
record as saying it will not lift the embargo until Canada addresses the
other issues that the US considers as unfair trading practice. The issue
has moved from science and food safety to politics, olitics that reflect
the anti-Canadian bias of your government. As a result, the Canadian
beef industry is suffering greatly, and rural economy in my area of the
country is also suffering. All because of long-standing US bias against
Canada.

There are a few factual flaws in the above:
# of cases of BSE:
http://www.oie.int/eng/info/en_esbmonde.htm

Current bans:
http://www.inspection.gc.ca/english/...109ria_e.shtml
*notice that this is a CANADIAN site*

Which is actually kinda funny in a way when you consider:
http://www.bseinfo.org/
or
http://makeashorterlink.com/?W29265B57
if the first one is a little too "biased" for....

Hmmmm, I think your argument is a little off. Okay, WAY off.... The
only bad thing I can think of about Canada or Canadians is that they
whine far too much about the US. ;-)
--
Warren
(use troutbum_mt (at) yahoo to reply via email)
For Conclave Info:
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troutbum_mt wrote:
There are a few factual flaws in the above:
# of cases of BSE:
http://www.oie.int/eng/info/en_esbmonde.htm
The 1993 case of BSE was in an animal imported from Britain. When I said
1, was referrring to the recent outbreak that resulted in the ban.

Current bans:
http://www.inspection.gc.ca/english/...109ria_e.shtml
*notice that this is a CANADIAN site*

I am not sure what your point is here. The canadian ban is less
restrictive than the US ban, as it excludes "exempted products include
animals imported for zoos or for scientific research, embryos, cattle
imported for immediate slaughter, boneless beef from cattle under 30
months of age" Cattle for immediate slaughter can still enter Canada
from teh US, Canadian cattle cannot enter the US.

Which is actually kinda funny in a way when you consider:
http://www.bseinfo.org/

Not sure what you want me to look at here?

http://makeashorterlink.com/?W29265B57

All I see there is that the US couldn't trace the animals the BSE case
came in contact with. They slaughtered 255, In Canada, several thousand
animals were slaughtered. They were much more easily traced as having
been in contact with the infected animal as Canada has a national cattle
id system. Also, the article says there are likely more cases of BSE in
the US. You want to blame that on Canada too?

Hmmmm, I think your argument is a little off. Okay, WAY off.... The
only bad thing I can think of about Canada or Canadians is that they
whine far too much about the US. ;-)

I think you are proving the original point.

Tim Lysyk

says...
The 1993 case of BSE was in an animal imported from Britain. When I said
1, was referrring to the recent outbreak that resulted in the ban.

So what you are saying is that it was Britain's fault? If so, then
wouldn't the animal that was received in the US *from* Canada be
Canada's fault? Realistically, I am sure that Canada did whatever it
took to keep it to just one animal, much as the US is currently trying
to do. Do you not think that Canada banned importing British beef until
it was safe to do so? We are dealing with a disease and "fair" doesn't
always apply. There is also a political angle to this. If Canada
raised a big stink about US beef, wouldn't that in effect be condemning
their own industry? Hell, they even state that "The Canadian approach
to the recent detection of an infected animal in the United States is
similar in thoroughness to our previous efforts. As we learned through
our own experience, the appropriate response to a case of BSE involves a
thorough, exhaustive and scientifically validated investigation."

Nowhere do they say that the US is being unfair or even suggest the
notion. To stop the spread of a disease, quarantines are sometimes
used. That is basically all that is happening right now. The two
countries are merely trying to keep their herds separated so that they
can ensure that they are BSE free. To people outside the loop in Canada
who seem to be paranoid about all that is American, yeah, it seems
unfair if you only look at one side of the story.


I am not sure what your point is here. The canadian ban is less
restrictive than the US ban, as it excludes "exempted products include
animals imported for zoos or for scientific research, embryos, cattle
imported for immediate slaughter, boneless beef from cattle under 30
months of age" Cattle for immediate slaughter can still enter Canada
from teh US, Canadian cattle cannot enter the US.

I didn't see any evidence of Canada's restrictions being "less
restrictive" when I read:

"The following animals and animal by-products are prohibited:
I) Live animals of the family Bovidae which includes cattle, bison and
water buffalo, sheep and goats
ii) meat or meat products from the animals of the family Bovidae where
the and things containing such meat or meat products
iii) animal food containing ingredients derived from animals of the
family Bovidae
iv) fertilizer, excluding manure containing ingredients from animals of
the family Bovidae
v) specified risk material"

How do you get more restrictive than that? By banning turkeys when the
disease is limited to bovine?

Which is actually kinda funny in a way when you consider:
http://www.bseinfo.org/

Not sure what you want me to look at here?

You obviously never made it to the second sentence which was "This site
includes information about the single BSE case found in a Washington
State dairy cow ******imported from Canada******** as well as background
information about the beef industry and about BSE." (emphasis added)

http://makeashorterlink.com/?W29265B57

All I see there is that the US couldn't trace the animals the BSE case
came in contact with. They slaughtered 255, In Canada, several thousand
animals were slaughtered. They were much more easily traced as having
been in contact with the infected animal as Canada has a national cattle
id system. Also, the article says there are likely more cases of BSE in
the US. You want to blame that on Canada too?

Hmmmmmm, you seem to skip over parts..... You must have missed:

"A total of 255 animals of interest were identified" by USDA
investigators as possibly linked to *******the infected dairy cow's
birth herd in Alberta, Canada*********, DeHaven said. (again, emphasis
added)

Here is another that you must have missed:
"The infected Holstein cow was ******born on a dairy farm in Alberta on
April 9, 1997,******** and shipped to the United States in September
2001." (emphasis added again)

Hmmmm, I think your argument is a little off. Okay, WAY off.... The
only bad thing I can think of about Canada or Canadians is that they
whine far too much about the US. ;-)

I think you are proving the original point.

Yes, I think I proved RW's point rather well: Canadians do whine and
seem to be paranoid about US conspiracies when in fact we really don't
think of Canada much at all. Or are you talking about my original point
that your argument was way off from a factual basis? Yeah, I agree with
that conclusion too.

Or are you talking about what is becoming painfully obvious; that
Canadians read selectively or not at all? *****BSEG******
(emphasis added) g

Personally, I don't see anything wrong with the policies that both
countries are currently using. The risk of infecting each other's
industries is highly likely if we swept it under the rug and just kept
on going as business as usual. Canada isn't ready to jeopardize their
industry because there is a lot of money involved. The US isn't willing
to jeopardize their industry because there are several times the amount
of money involved as in Canada. To be honest with you, until your
recent "paranoid delusion?", I never thought of Canada's cattle any
differently than cattle from Idaho or Texas; probably because the state
of Montana is linked pretty closely to the Canadian industry. I never
questioned Canada's motives but I am now seeing maple leaves behind
every brand! Those ****ing Canuckistanis are around here somewhere
dammit! bseg In all seriousness, I don't see this issue as anything
other than damn good judgement on both sides of the border. But what
the **** do I know? I just majored in Livestock Management......
--
Warren
(use troutbum_mt (at) yahoo to reply via email)
For Conclave Info:
http://www.geocities.com/troutbum_mt...nConclave.html