OT American Taliban in Congress and the White House

Mark wrote:

The religious right does not embrace the
traditional Republican values of fiscal conservancy and limited government
intrusion.

Traditional Republican values??? Gag!

Fiscal conservatism? Are you aware of which way the deficit is headed,
taking Social Security along with it? The Republicans control the
Presidency and Congress, but they blame the "Clinton recession,"
neglecting to mention that Clinton left them with a record surplus, and
surpluses projected as far as the eye could see, and they squandered it
on reckless tax cuts for the wealthy.

When someone points this out, they scream "class warfare." I love
Warren Buffet's comment: "If class warfare is being waged in America, my
class is clearly winning."

As for limited government intrusion, that's an even bigger joke. Are you
comfortable with John Ashcroft administering the so-called Patriot Act?
Now we have a Bush proposal to amend the Constitution to ban same-sex
marriage, for God's sake. The Republicans try to use the Constitution to
exploit wedge issues in nearly every election year. In 1980 Reagan
supported an amendment to ban abortion, and this still remains in the
party platform. In 1988 George H. W. Bush called for an amendment
outlawing flag burning. In 1996 Bob Dole supported amendments on flag
burning, school prayer, and a mandated balanced budget. (Sweet irony,
there.) The 1996 party platform also called for amendments on term
limits, citizenship for children of illegal aliens, and victims' rights.

--
Cut "to the chase" for my email address.

On Tue, 09 Mar 2004 13:03:23 -0700, rw
wrote:

Mark wrote:

The religious right does not embrace the
traditional Republican values of fiscal conservancy and limited government
intrusion.

Traditional Republican values??? Gag!

Once upon a time those were the cornerstones of the Republican
platform.

(snipped)

As for limited government intrusion, that's an even bigger joke. Are you
comfortable with John Ashcroft

I'm not very comfortable with John Ashcroft being of the same species
I am.

administering the so-called Patriot Act?

I wouldn't trust Mother Teresa (if she came back) to administer that
Act.


--

rbc:vixen,Minnow Goddess,Willow Watcher,and all that sort of thing.
Often taunted by trout.
Only a fool would refuse to believe in luck. Only a damn fool would rely on it.

http://www.visi.com/~cyli

lid wrote:
On Tue, 09 Mar 2004 13:03:23 -0700, rw
wrote:


Mark wrote:

The religious right does not embrace the
traditional Republican values of fiscal conservancy and limited government
intrusion.

Traditional Republican values??? Gag!


Once upon a time those were the cornerstones of the Republican
platform.

Right you are. Back in Teddy Roosevelt's time.

If Barry Goldwater were alive today, he'd be a Democrat.

--
Cut "to the chase" for my email address.

rw:
Right you are. Back in Teddy Roosevelt's time.
If Barry Goldwater were alive today, he'd be a Democrat.

Do you mean in the McCain sort or manner?

--
Stev Lenon 91B20 '68-'69
Drowning flies to Dark Star

http://web.tampabay.rr.com/stevglo/i...age92kword.htm

rw wrote:
lid wrote:

Once upon a time those were the cornerstones of the Republican
platform.

Right you are. Back in Teddy Roosevelt's time. ...

Saw a Theodore Rossevelt quote the other day that is as apropos
today as it was when it was uttered in 1918:

"To announce that there must be no criticism of the president,
or that we are to stand by the president, right or wrong, is
not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable
to the American public."
--Theodore Roosevelt

--
Ken Fortenberry

On Wed, 10 Mar 2004 16:08:12 GMT, Ken Fortenberry
wrote:

rw wrote:
lid wrote:

Once upon a time those were the cornerstones of the Republican
platform.

Right you are. Back in Teddy Roosevelt's time. ...

Saw a Theodore Rossevelt quote the other day that is as apropos
today as it was when it was uttered in 1918:

"To announce that there must be no criticism of the president,
or that we are to stand by the president, right or wrong, is
not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable
to the American public."
--Theodore Roosevelt


You didn't post that in 1998 ;-)

"Ken Fortenberry" wrote...
rw wrote:
lid wrote:

Once upon a time those were the cornerstones of the Republican
platform.

Right you are. Back in Teddy Roosevelt's time. ...

Saw a Theodore Rossevelt quote the other day that is as apropos
today as it was when it was uttered in 1918:

"To announce that there must be no criticism of the president,
or that we are to stand by the president, right or wrong, is
not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable
to the American public."
--Theodore Roosevelt

Here's another that's also quite apropos:
"If [peace activists] could only be prevailed upon to sum up eloquently the many
unspeakable miseries and horrors of War, and to present them to their own
country as a conclusive reason for its being undefended against War, and
becoming a prey of the first despot who might choose to inflict those miseries
and horrors- why then I really believe we should have got to the very best joke
we could hope to have in our whole Complete Jest Book for Posterity and might
fold our arms and rest convinced that we had done enough for that discerning
Patriarch's amusement."
--Theodore Roosevelt
--
TL,
Tim
------------------------
http://css.sbcma.com/timj

"To announce that there must be no criticism of the president,
or that we are to stand by the president, right or wrong, is
not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable
to the American public."
--Theodore Roosevelt

--
Ken Fortenberry

So how do you reconcile this hero's utterance with your own willingness to
personally attack an individual who disagrees with you? You have so little
respect for ayone of a differing opinion, one senses the willingness to
murder, or kill. As Jesus said, if you utter the phrase, :"you idiot", you
are guilty of murder. So Teddy, being a Calvinist as I am, believed that all
men are created in God's image, and are entitled to a certain basic respect,
and further, that criticizing the idea is not the same as criticizing the
man who advances the idea. These concepts produced great men like Teddy
Roosevelt, and many others, but are so missing today. Each time you attack
an individual you move society closer to a Hitler/Pol Pot/ Stalin model, and
further away from what you seem to appreciate in this quote from Teddy. Are
you too dense, too consumed by hatred to see this?

"Darwin Vander Stelt" schrieb im Newsbeitrag
...
SNIP
. Are
you too dense, too consumed by hatred to see this?


You were doing great, until you called hin dense.

TL
MC

Darwin Vander Stelt wrote:

... So Teddy, being a Calvinist as I am, ...

You're a Calvinist ? ME TOO !! That Hobbes was one way cool
stuffed tiger, wasn't he ?

Ponder this traditional Zulu oral teaching translated into the English
and transcribed by the novelist Jordan Ngubane.

================================================== ==================================
I evolve forever, in response to the challenge of being human.
I have a mind to light my path in the mazes of the cosmic order.
This mind has many sides;
It comprehends all things;
It establishes my right to latitude; to being heard;
It makes me feel at home in the cosmic order.
My neighbor has a mind;
It, also, comprehends all things.
My neighbor and I have the same origins;
We have the same life-experience and a common destiny;
We are the obverse and reverse sides of one entity;
We are unchanging equals;
We are the faces which see themselves in each other;
We are mutually fulfilling complements;
We are simultaneously legitimate values;
My neighbor's sorrow is my sorrow;
His joy is my joy.
He and I are mutually fulfilled when we stand by each other in moments of need.
His survival is a precondition of my survival.
That which is freely asked or freely given is love;
Imposed love is a crime against humanity.
I am sovereign of my life;
My neighbor is sovereign of his life;
Society is a collective sovereignty;
It exists to ensure that my neighbor and I realize the promise of being human.
I have no right to anything I deny my neighbor...
I define myself in what I do to my neighbor.
No community has any right to prescribe destiny for other communities...
Equals do not prescribe destiny for each other;
They hold conversations of minds.
================================================== ===============================


--
Ken Fortenberry