As much ROFF as anything

Mike Connor wrote:
snip
It may well be that we can´t all just get along. Assuming such to be the
case, then why are we all here? Just to waste time with absolutely hopeless
"sounding-off"?

Exactly. It's fun, it's entertaining, and it costs nothing because
I use DSL for work anyway. It's ALL about wasting time. And don't
say that like it's a bad thing, we all obviously have loads of time
to waste.

... Like
a number of other things it has become almost meaningless.

Yeah, it's a waste of time, but so long as you have friends here,
and I most definitely and emphatically consider you a friend, it's
not meaningless.

--
Ken Fortenberry

Ken Fortenberry wrote:

Mike Connor wrote:

snip
It may well be that we can´t all just get along. Assuming such to be the
case, then why are we all here? Just to waste time with absolutely
hopeless
"sounding-off"?


Exactly. It's fun, it's entertaining,

I'm probably going to regret this, but I am curious about that
statement. I agree that some of the banter and the intellectual
jousting can be entertaining. But the part I don't get is the veiled
(or sometimes, not-so-veiled) threats of physical violence and the
insults that resemble schoolyard taunting.

It doesn't bother me in the sense that I'm offended, it just doesn't
make a lot of sense to me. I've been around newsgroups since 1991, and
spent a good bit of time on political groups, so I've seen my fair share
of the good, bad and ugly (mostly ugly). But I came to expect the worst
when the only common ground those folks had was their hatred of the
opposite side.

Here we supposedly have a common love of ff'ing, and in fact, most
of the participants in the most egregious name-calling have fished
together (and apparently, in some cases even enjoyed it). That's the
part I don't get, and can't really find humor in.

I still follow (most of) the threads, so I guess it's at least
intriguing (in a car-wreck-by-the-highway sense), but why is it
entertaining to call your fellow flyfisherman a poopie head?

Yeah, it's a waste of time, but so long as you have friends here,
and I most definitely and emphatically consider you a friend, it's
not meaningless.

This is not directed (just) at you, Ken, but since you brought up
the idea of friends: It sure seems like a number of folks here have
gone out of their way to alienate any possible friends they might have
had here.

Then what will you be left with?


Chuck Vance

Conan the Librarian wrote:
Ken Fortenberry wrote:

Mike Connor wrote:

snip
It may well be that we can´t all just get along. Assuming such to
be the case, then why are we all here? Just to waste time with
absolutely hopeless
"sounding-off"?


Exactly. It's fun, it's entertaining,

I'm probably going to regret this, but I am curious about that
statement. I agree that some of the banter and the intellectual
jousting can be entertaining. But the part I don't get is the veiled
(or sometimes, not-so-veiled) threats of physical violence and the
insults that resemble schoolyard taunting.

It doesn't bother me in the sense that I'm offended, it just
doesn't make a lot of sense to me. I've been around newsgroups since
1991, and spent a good bit of time on political groups, so I've seen
my fair share of the good, bad and ugly (mostly ugly). But I came to
expect the worst when the only common ground those folks had was
their hatred of the opposite side.

Here we supposedly have a common love of ff'ing, and in fact, most
of the participants in the most egregious name-calling have fished
together (and apparently, in some cases even enjoyed it). That's the
part I don't get, and can't really find humor in.

I still follow (most of) the threads, so I guess it's at least
intriguing (in a car-wreck-by-the-highway sense), but why is it
entertaining to call your fellow flyfisherman a poopie head?

Yeah, it's a waste of time, but so long as you have friends here,
and I most definitely and emphatically consider you a friend, it's
not meaningless.

This is not directed (just) at you, Ken, but since you brought up
the idea of friends: It sure seems like a number of folks here have
gone out of their way to alienate any possible friends they might have
had here.

Then what will you be left with?

Good points all. It occurred to me that we haven't had a good roffian
tragedy in recent times to bring the touch of reality and
meaning-of-life-lesson to focus. I see a post like Frank wrote about his
FIL, or Barry wrote about his father, and it humbles me and makes me
recall a not-so-distant memory. When my son had his snow boarding
accident last year and shattered his back, many of the folks here
rallied around me with support, empathy, and good wishes. This wasn't
just "virtual" to me, my family, or my son, especially when he started
receiving get well cards from people not only that he hadn't met, but I
hadn't met either. Roffians offered more than just well-wishes in the
form of offers to travel and help us any way they could. That stuff is
real to me. On a personal level, I've seen things differently from that
time on. Skies are brighter, the sun's warmth is greater, and ff'ing is
an inspiration. I'm not good at putting how I feel about this stuff into
words like some others here, but this was a life-changing circumstance
in more ways than one, and roff is a part of that. It will not take
another tragedy like that to make me realize what I have and what I hold
dear.

Yeah, maudlin - sue me.
--
TL,
Tim
------------------------
http://css.sbcma.com/timj

Yeah, maudlin - sue me.

Ditto the sentiment. When we had the sniper down here in DC, I had
people from Mass to Montana offering a place for my family to stay.
This place, for all its failings and flames, is a family.
You may see me throwing humor in to some of these flame wars. Its my
nature. I grew up in an area with a serious tendency to violence and a
high murder rate. I've seen the same around the world in multiple war
zones. Alot of it was people refusing to listen or ignoring the basic
needs and consideration of others. "Its all about me" turns real ugly
real fast.
Then again, I like a tag line in alt.callahans:
Some people are offence kleptomaniacs -- whenever they see
an offence that isn't nailed down, they take it ;-)
--David C. Pugh, in alt.callahans
--
Frank Reid
Reverse Email to reply

"Frank Reid" wrote in message
...

Yeah, maudlin - sue me.

Ditto the sentiment. When we had the sniper down here in DC, I had people
from Mass to Montana offering a place for my family to stay. This place,
for all its failings and flames, is a family.


To pitch in on the maudlin side, it IS a family for me. Unlike you guys,
who get the luxury of having conversations with any number of compatriots
any day of the year, I get to speak English to only about 20 other adults
daily, and almost never get to talk at length about the things I really
love, like ff'ing. Hell, I barely even get to GO ff'ing! The discussions
here, the mental extensions of meeting IRL (about 15 roffians and counting),
and the continuances of conversations in the past are all much more real
life for me than I pretend they are. I'm not sitting here typing at my
compter, I'm taking to several dozen people I 'know' in a manner that we all
are acquainted and comfortable with. When I post my "they're shooting up the
place" posts and got dozens of "keep your head down"s, I really appreciated
the sentiments; exactly as if I was leaning over the backyard fence talking
to the neighbor. When I post my 'anyone know about xxx' questions, its
pretty equivalent to what any of you might say to the buddy next to you at
the bar offhandedly one day. I don't get to do that....its all smalltalk
with Embassy folks, or professional bitching with colleagues, so shallow
noun-verb conversations in French with someone who just sees a big walking
wallet. It took several years before I felt comfortable enough to let it
hang out here, and I appreciate having this place to hang out in. Its a
virtual Cheer's barroom.

So when I see this virtual barroom becoming a brawl, and outside its all
snowy and cold and miserable, I take it rather personally. This place is a
bit more than 'just entertainment' to me. And I bet I'm not the only one.

--riverman
(next round is on me, guys (and gals))

I get to speak English to only about 20 other adults
daily, and almost never get to talk at length about the things I really
love, like ff'ing.
--riverman
(next round is on me, guys (and gals))

Note: This number was reduced to 2 whilst in Wales.

--
Frank Reid
Reverse Email to reply

"Frank Reid" wrote in message
...
I get to speak English to only about 20 other adults
daily, and almost never get to talk at length about the things I really
love, like ff'ing. --riverman
(next round is on me, guys (and gals))

Note: This number was reduced to 2 whilst in Wales.


I never posted the story about hanging out in a bar one evening with three
locals, just enjoying the company and conversation with a few locals: one
brash woman, a refined man, and a hard-spoken bricklayer. As the evening
wore on, the woman (a Brit) got harsher and harsher, getting the the face of
her friends. The Bricklayer eventually shrugged his shoulders, finished his
beer and left. The genteel guy (a Welchman) was being assaulted on
everything he said about the weather, the soccer match, everything.
Eventually I told him that this woman provided a pefect example of why the
americans finally kicked the brits out, and the Welch sure could learn from
our lesson. The Welch bartender bought me a beer for that.

--riverman

"Frank Reid" wrote in message
...
I get to speak English to only about 20 other adults
daily, and almost never get to talk at length about the things I really
love, like ff'ing. --riverman
(next round is on me, guys (and gals))

Note: This number was reduced to 2 whilst in Wales.


I never posted the story about hanging out in a bar one evening with three
locals, just enjoying the company and conversation with a few locals: one
brash woman, a refined man, and a hard-spoken bricklayer. As the evening
wore on, the woman (a Brit) got harsher and harsher, getting the the face of
her friends. The Bricklayer eventually shrugged his shoulders, finished his
beer and left. The genteel guy (a Welchman) was being assaulted on
everything he said about the weather, the soccer match, everything.
Eventually I told him that this woman provided a pefect example of why the
americans finally kicked the brits out, and the Welch sure could learn from
our lesson. The Welch bartender bought me a beer for that.

--riverman

I get to speak English to only about 20 other adults
daily, and almost never get to talk at length about the things I really
love, like ff'ing.
--riverman
(next round is on me, guys (and gals))

Note: This number was reduced to 2 whilst in Wales.

--
Frank Reid
Reverse Email to reply

"Frank Reid" wrote in message
...

Yeah, maudlin - sue me.

Ditto the sentiment. When we had the sniper down here in DC, I had people
from Mass to Montana offering a place for my family to stay. This place,
for all its failings and flames, is a family.


To pitch in on the maudlin side, it IS a family for me. Unlike you guys,
who get the luxury of having conversations with any number of compatriots
any day of the year, I get to speak English to only about 20 other adults
daily, and almost never get to talk at length about the things I really
love, like ff'ing. Hell, I barely even get to GO ff'ing! The discussions
here, the mental extensions of meeting IRL (about 15 roffians and counting),
and the continuances of conversations in the past are all much more real
life for me than I pretend they are. I'm not sitting here typing at my
compter, I'm taking to several dozen people I 'know' in a manner that we all
are acquainted and comfortable with. When I post my "they're shooting up the
place" posts and got dozens of "keep your head down"s, I really appreciated
the sentiments; exactly as if I was leaning over the backyard fence talking
to the neighbor. When I post my 'anyone know about xxx' questions, its
pretty equivalent to what any of you might say to the buddy next to you at
the bar offhandedly one day. I don't get to do that....its all smalltalk
with Embassy folks, or professional bitching with colleagues, so shallow
noun-verb conversations in French with someone who just sees a big walking
wallet. It took several years before I felt comfortable enough to let it
hang out here, and I appreciate having this place to hang out in. Its a
virtual Cheer's barroom.

So when I see this virtual barroom becoming a brawl, and outside its all
snowy and cold and miserable, I take it rather personally. This place is a
bit more than 'just entertainment' to me. And I bet I'm not the only one.

--riverman
(next round is on me, guys (and gals))