The "Great" Communicator

"Greg Pavlov" wrote...
"Collective Amnesia or Collective Alzheimer's: snip

Hey! First the TR, THEN the left-wing agenda bull****. Get yer priorities in
order, man.

I'm sorry I couldn't join you guys out there - from Peter's TR it sounds like a
blast.
--
TL,
Tim
http://css.sbcma.com/timj

FDR wasn't a good enough man to wipe Reagan's ass. Reagan got us out of the
recession that Carter put us in, in 4 years. FDR couldn't even help the
economy a little bit in a decade and a half. You liberals don't get it when
it comes to honesty, integrity and decency. Anyone who voted for Clinton in
'96 or Gore in 2000 is proof of what I'm saying. Reagan was a man of
principle, but of course you have no idea what that means. I'd take 1 Ronald
Reagan over 100 FDRs and Bill Clintons if I needed a man to help me or the
country.

Gene

"Greg Pavlov" wrote in message
...
"Collective Amnesia or Collective Alzheimer's: America 'Remembers'
Ronald Reagan"
by Paul Douglas Newman

To remember Ronald Reagan as one of the greatest Presidents of the
twentieth century, to replace FDR on the dime with Reagan's profile as
Republicans wish to do, we are being asked to forget too much.

We are asked to forget Lebanon, where Reagan decided to "cut and run"
after hundreds of Marines perished when a suicide bomber invaded their
compound.

We are asked to forget the arms for hostages deal.

We are asked to forget El Salvador, where the right wing ARENA, armed
with Reagan money, Reagan weapons, and Reagan military training from
the School of the America's at Fort Benning, Georgia slaughtered more
than 80,000 civilians in the "War on Communism."

We are asked to forget the Iran-Contra Scandal, an event that he
evidently "could not recall" in response to more than one hundred
questions during the Congressional hearings.

We are asked to forget the groundwork laid for nuclear disarmament by
Presidents Eisenhower, Kennedy, and Nixon.

We are asked to forget the Strategic Arms Limitations Treaties I and
II.

We are asked to forget the re-freezing of the Cold War following the
Nixon thaw, when Reagan bellicosely denounced the Soviets as the "Evil
Empire," and then joked on his weekly radio address that our missiles
were ready to launch.

We are asked to forget the silly invasion of Grenada following the
Lebanon disaster, and the reversal of goodwill gestures made to the
Caribbean made by previous administrations, including the return of
the Panama Canal.

We are asked to forget the Soviet Union's internal move to
Perestroika, a groundswell that occurred over decades resulting in a
generation of new Communists by 1985 who were not manufactured by
Reagan's bravado, but were products of the "Evil Empire."

We are asked to forget that Reagan presided over the worst recession
since the Great Depression.

We are asked to forget the enormous cuts to social welfare programs
and the Veterans Administration, moves that led to such an enormous
rise in the homeless population, especially evident on the streets of
Washington, D.C., that even comedians felt that they had to do
something to stop the bleeding with "Comic Relief."

We are asked to forget the policies that enriched agri-business at the
expense of small farmers, continuing the decline of the family farm to
the point that recording artists were the only ones left to uphold
the Populists' mantle with "Farm-Aid."

We are asked to forget that he slashed taxes for the wealthiest,
raised taxes on the poor, and then bailed out the corrupt Savings and
Loan industry at taxpayer expense.

We are asked to forget that his SEC presided over such a corrupt and
over-inflated stock market that the Dow saw the largest one-day crash
in its history, greater than in 1929.

We are asked to forget that Reagan's economic policies effected a
reversal in the trend toward greater distribution of wealth begun by
Progressive Republican, Democratic, and Socialist politicians in the
early twentieth centuries, and have led us to the greatest
concentration of wealth today since the days of Andrew Carnegie and
James Pierpont Morgan.

We are asked to forget the enormous and outrageous military contracts,
for which American taxpayers
paid hundreds of dollars for nuts, bolts, and toilet seats, and the
nation saw defense-spending rise to astronomical heights.

We are asked to forget the Reagan Administration's opposition to the
Civil Rights movement, their blocking of busing programs and cuts to
Head Start meant to bring equality of opportunity to American
education.

We are asked to forget that Reagan considered ketchup to be a
vegetable in federal school lunch programs.

We are asked to forget "government cheese."

We are asked to forget jelly beans, splitting wood, bad b-movies,
McCarthy-ite participation in Hollywood blacklisting.

We are asked to forget our history.

We are asked to forget, and forget, and forget.

And by the looks of the New York Times and Washington Post's memorials
to the "Great Communicator," it appears that what historian Studs
Terkel has referred to as "America's collective amnesia" is still
acute.

Perhaps it is more serious than that.

Perhaps we have a national case of Alzheimer's Disease.

Perhaps our ability to remember relatively recent events has eroded,
and our capacity for rational thought has diminished as well.

Perhaps we are becoming a danger to ourselves and others.

Perhaps we need admittance into a managed care facility for nations.

Perhaps we are "riding off into the sunset." How else do we explain
our descent into Bushism?: our quick repetition of past economic and
foreign policy blunders, our re-visitation of failed policies to solve
current problems, our persistent dementia that results in trying the
same things and expecting
different results? As of now, there is no cure for Alzheimer's
Disease, only management of the symptoms and provision of comfort
until death.

Hopefully Studs Terkel is right, and we've just suffered another blow
to the head from which the American people will recover, and
remember, and remember, and remember.

On Mon, 14 Jun 2004 02:09:23 GMT, "Gene Cottrell"
wrote:

FDR wasn't a good enough man to wipe Reagan's ass. Reagan got us out of the
recession that Carter put us in, in 4 years. FDR couldn't even help the
economy a little bit in a decade and a half. You liberals don't get it when
it comes to honesty, integrity and decency. Anyone who voted for Clinton in
'96 or Gore in 2000 is proof of what I'm saying. Reagan was a man of
principle, but of course you have no idea what that means. I'd take 1 Ronald
Reagan over 100 FDRs and Bill Clintons if I needed a man to help me or the
country.

Gene



Hah. By the end of Reagan's last term we were headed into another
recession. Or was that Carter's fault too.


g.c.

"Gene Cottrell" wrote in message
...
FDR wasn't a good enough man to wipe Reagan's ass. Reagan got us out of
the
recession that Carter put us in, in 4 years. FDR couldn't even help the
economy a little bit in a decade and a half. You liberals don't get it
when
it comes to honesty, integrity and decency. Anyone who voted for Clinton
in
'96 or Gore in 2000 is proof of what I'm saying. Reagan was a man of
principle, but of course you have no idea what that means. I'd take 1
Ronald
Reagan over 100 FDRs and Bill Clintons if I needed a man to help me or the
country.


You people who now term yourselves to be "conservatives" give conservatives
a bad name. Hint-take an economics course, and a government class. Oh and
save that honesty and integrity crap too, that's a bigger lie than the
Reagan "expansion". Lying about blow jobs is one thing, lying to kill
America's military personel is something altogether different.
Even Reagan was pragmatic enough to know when his "cuts" went too far and to
move them back. Hence his "expansion"

"Greg Pavlov" wrote in message
...
"Collective Amnesia or Collective Alzheimer's: America 'Remembers'
Ronald Reagan"
by Paul Douglas Newman

To remember Ronald Reagan as one of the greatest Presidents of the
twentieth century, to replace FDR on the dime with Reagan's profile as
Republicans wish to do, we are being asked to forget too much.

We are asked to forget Lebanon, where Reagan decided to "cut and run"
after hundreds of Marines perished when a suicide bomber invaded their
compound.

We are asked to forget the arms for hostages deal.

We are asked to forget El Salvador, where the right wing ARENA, armed
with Reagan money, Reagan weapons, and Reagan military training from
the School of the America's at Fort Benning, Georgia slaughtered more
than 80,000 civilians in the "War on Communism."

We are asked to forget the Iran-Contra Scandal, an event that he
evidently "could not recall" in response to more than one hundred
questions during the Congressional hearings.

We are asked to forget the groundwork laid for nuclear disarmament by
Presidents Eisenhower, Kennedy, and Nixon.

We are asked to forget the Strategic Arms Limitations Treaties I and
II.

We are asked to forget the re-freezing of the Cold War following the
Nixon thaw, when Reagan bellicosely denounced the Soviets as the "Evil
Empire," and then joked on his weekly radio address that our missiles
were ready to launch.

We are asked to forget the silly invasion of Grenada following the
Lebanon disaster, and the reversal of goodwill gestures made to the
Caribbean made by previous administrations, including the return of
the Panama Canal.

We are asked to forget the Soviet Union's internal move to
Perestroika, a groundswell that occurred over decades resulting in a
generation of new Communists by 1985 who were not manufactured by
Reagan's bravado, but were products of the "Evil Empire."

We are asked to forget that Reagan presided over the worst recession
since the Great Depression.

We are asked to forget the enormous cuts to social welfare programs
and the Veterans Administration, moves that led to such an enormous
rise in the homeless population, especially evident on the streets of
Washington, D.C., that even comedians felt that they had to do
something to stop the bleeding with "Comic Relief."

We are asked to forget the policies that enriched agri-business at the
expense of small farmers, continuing the decline of the family farm to
the point that recording artists were the only ones left to uphold
the Populists' mantle with "Farm-Aid."

We are asked to forget that he slashed taxes for the wealthiest,
raised taxes on the poor, and then bailed out the corrupt Savings and
Loan industry at taxpayer expense.

We are asked to forget that his SEC presided over such a corrupt and
over-inflated stock market that the Dow saw the largest one-day crash
in its history, greater than in 1929.

We are asked to forget that Reagan's economic policies effected a
reversal in the trend toward greater distribution of wealth begun by
Progressive Republican, Democratic, and Socialist politicians in the
early twentieth centuries, and have led us to the greatest
concentration of wealth today since the days of Andrew Carnegie and
James Pierpont Morgan.

We are asked to forget the enormous and outrageous military contracts,
for which American taxpayers
paid hundreds of dollars for nuts, bolts, and toilet seats, and the
nation saw defense-spending rise to astronomical heights.

We are asked to forget the Reagan Administration's opposition to the
Civil Rights movement, their blocking of busing programs and cuts to
Head Start meant to bring equality of opportunity to American
education.

We are asked to forget that Reagan considered ketchup to be a
vegetable in federal school lunch programs.

We are asked to forget "government cheese."

We are asked to forget jelly beans, splitting wood, bad b-movies,
McCarthy-ite participation in Hollywood blacklisting.

We are asked to forget our history.

We are asked to forget, and forget, and forget.

And by the looks of the New York Times and Washington Post's memorials
to the "Great Communicator," it appears that what historian Studs
Terkel has referred to as "America's collective amnesia" is still
acute.

Perhaps it is more serious than that.

Perhaps we have a national case of Alzheimer's Disease.

Perhaps our ability to remember relatively recent events has eroded,
and our capacity for rational thought has diminished as well.

Perhaps we are becoming a danger to ourselves and others.

Perhaps we need admittance into a managed care facility for nations.

Perhaps we are "riding off into the sunset." How else do we explain
our descent into Bushism?: our quick repetition of past economic and
foreign policy blunders, our re-visitation of failed policies to solve
current problems, our persistent dementia that results in trying the
same things and expecting
different results? As of now, there is no cure for Alzheimer's
Disease, only management of the symptoms and provision of comfort
until death.

Hopefully Studs Terkel is right, and we've just suffered another blow
to the head from which the American people will recover, and
remember, and remember, and remember.

The Neocons are looking for a patriarchal figure to give some legitimacy to
their ruining of the country, high crimes and misdemeanors and ignoring the
Constitution. There's no one in the Bush administration or connected to it
who can lend it any credence to their moral or political actions at all. If
they think making a saint out of Reagan is going to convince anyone that
they are his political heirs and not just a gang of thieves and idiots they
are going to have to dig him up an burry him about a dozen more times
A good place to memorialize Reagan would be a plaque on ever shopping cart
in every super market in the country. Reagan moved a lot of people out of
mental hospitals, jails and their own homes and put them in shopping carts.

Greg Pavlov wrote in
:

"Collective Amnesia or Collective Alzheimer's: America 'Remembers'
Ronald Reagan"
by Paul Douglas Newman

To remember Ronald Reagan as one of the greatest Presidents of the
twentieth century, to replace FDR on the dime with Reagan's profile as
Republicans wish to do, we are being asked to forget too much.

Greg

I think we're collectively remembering Reagan fondly now for a number of
reasons.

A- It's an election year, and the Republicans are cramming it down our
throats. I have a feeling that this might prove disadvantageous to them,
as GW's leadership doesn't compare very well to Reagan's

B- Our international goings-on are looking fairly dismal these days. The
people need a hero, and a dead one is preferable to none. People look
upon the Reagan years as a time when we recovered from stagflation, our
hostages were freed, and communism fell (whether or not you can attribute
those to Reagan, or how directly, I won't bother arguing), so he's as
good a hero as any.

C- Some bad stuff happened during the Reagan years, but at least the buck
stopped at his desk. I remember him accepting responsibility for those
dead marines (BTW, I also remember one of the family members refusing to
shake Reagan's hand at the services). GW accepts responsibility for
nada,and Reagan looks like a block of solid concrete next to Dub. The
exception is Iran-Contra. Tragically, when Reagan said he didn't
remember selling weapons to people who hated us to fund an illegal war,
he might have been telling the truth.

Scott

"Scott Seidman" wrote in message
. 1.4...
Tragically, when Reagan said he didn't
remember selling weapons to people who hated us to fund an illegal war,
he might have been telling the truth.



Someone quipped at the time that he couldn't decide which was worse; that
Reagan DID remember, or that he really DIDN'T.

--riverman

You liberals don't get it when
it comes to honesty, integrity and decency. Anyone who voted for Clinton
in
'96 or Gore in 2000 is proof of what I'm saying. Reagan was a man of
principle, but of course you have no idea what that means.
Gene

Please expand upon the principles involved in behind the scenes negotiations
that kept our Marines in captivity in Iran until Reagan took office, for his
political advantage. As a veteran, that seems to me to have broken faith
with both the troops and to have violated his oath of office even as he took
it.

--
Stev Lenon 91B20 '68-'69
Drowning flies to Dark Star

http://web.tampabay.rr.com/stevglo/i...age92kword.htm

"B J Conner" wrote in message
...

....A good place to memorialize Reagan would be a plaque on ever
shopping cart
in every super market in the country. Reagan moved a lot of people
out of
mental hospitals, jails and their own homes and put them in
shopping carts.

Hee, hee, hee.

Now THERE'S an observation that will atone for a lot of past sins.

Wolfgang
c'mon, wayno, even YOU gotta admit there was nothin' but net on that
one.

"Wolfgang" wrote in message
...

"B J Conner" wrote in message
...

....A good place to memorialize Reagan would be a plaque on ever
shopping cart
in every super market in the country. Reagan moved a lot of people
out of
mental hospitals, jails and their own homes and put them in
shopping carts.

Hee, hee, hee.

Now THERE'S an observation that will atone for a lot of past sins.

Wolfgang
c'mon, wayno, even YOU gotta admit there was nothin' but net on that
one.

just another example to prove my contention that the least important
factor in determining the value of any given human being is his political
viewpoint.



yfitons
wayno