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Wolfgang wrote:
"Ken Fortenberry wrote:
Like I told Choc, you can argue etymology but you cannot
argue the fact that it's an offensive racial slur.

It seems to me that the use of offensive racial slurs
should be discouraged rather than encouraged.

No way forward......and no way back......and the more you struggle, the
faster you sink.

Scary stuff, huh?

What in the hell are you driveling on about now ?

Anybody who claims that "squaw" isn't an offensive racial
slur in 21st century America is either a fool or a liar.
If you want to argue that "squaw" is not an offensive racial
slur you might take some pride in knowing that I consider
you a liar.

--
Ken Fortenberry

"Ken Fortenberry" wrote in message
m...
Wolfgang wrote:
"Ken Fortenberry wrote:
Like I told Choc, you can argue etymology but you cannot
argue the fact that it's an offensive racial slur.

It seems to me that the use of offensive racial slurs
should be discouraged rather than encouraged.

No way forward......and no way back......and the more you struggle, the
faster you sink.

Scary stuff, huh?

What in the hell are you driveling on about now ?

Anybody who claims that "squaw" isn't an offensive racial
slur in 21st century America is either a fool or a liar.
If you want to argue that "squaw" is not an offensive racial
slur you might take some pride in knowing that I consider
you a liar.

Faster and faster.

It's certainly true that you're not the only person in the world.....or in
ROFF.....who thinks women are inferior but so far you're still the only one
here who has expressed a belief that they constitute a race.

Wolfgang

In article ,
says...
wrote:
says...
wrote:
says...
Nope, it's a racial slur without a doubt. That's not even
a debatable point. Well, I won't debate it with you at any
rate, as far as I'm concerned it's a racial slur and that's
that.
Well my squaw doesn't object and that counts for more than some
hypersensitive liberal white-boy from cornfield land.
Your **** is in the minority.

Not in my poll of squaws....betcha I know a whole lot more than
you do.

If you don't know that squaw is an offensive racial slur
then what you know, no matter how much, is just flat wrong.

You are truly an idiot.
- Ken

wrote:
says...
If you don't know that squaw is an offensive racial slur
then what you know, no matter how much, is just flat wrong.

You are truly an idiot.

Anybody who claims that "squaw" isn't an offensive racial
slur in 21st century America is either a fool or a liar.
And FWIW I consider you to be truthful.

--
Ken Fortenberry

In article ,
says...
wrote:
says...
If you don't know that squaw is an offensive racial slur
then what you know, no matter how much, is just flat wrong.

You are truly an idiot.

Anybody who claims that "squaw" isn't an offensive racial
slur in 21st century America is either a fool or a liar.
And FWIW I consider you to be truthful.

"The English word "squaw" was borrowed from the Algonquian language
family of a few Indian tribes in Canada and New England and first
appeared in the American vocabulary around 1634.1 It has been used in
literature and historical documents for much of this country’s history.
The Massachusett/Algonquian word means "young woman."

"Squaw" has been a familiar word in American literature and language
since the 17th century and has always been normally understood to mean
"an Indian woman or wife." The term as commonly used contains no
disrespect to Indian women any more than the words "woman" or "wife" do
to Anglo-American women.
"

"English and Native American linguists agree that there is absolutely no
connection between the Mohawk [Iroquoian] word otsiskwa (also spelled
ojiskwa) and the Algonquin word squa.
"

You've fallen victim to actually believing the crap that the
loony left spouts.

"
The controversy over the use of the word "squaw" appears to have started
in 1973 with the book Literature of the American Indian, by Thomas E.
Sanders and Walter W. Peek. Sanders and Peek are members of two
different Indian Nations in Florida. Although they are not linguists,
their book puts forth a rather racist and inflammatory accusation about
the origin of the word ‘squaw’:
"

The fact that you've been bamboozled by two liberals with an agenda is
just sad, the fact that you are belittling others who know better is
wrong.
- Ken

wrote:

The fact that you've been bamboozled by two liberals with an agenda is
just sad, the fact that you are belittling others who know better is
wrong.

These self-appointed word censors aren't "liberal" in the normal sense
of the word, any more than the free-spending, war-crazy,
environment-trashing, civil-rights-violating radicals in the
administration are "conservative" in the normal sense of the word.

--
Cut "to the chase" for my email address.

wrote:
says...
Anybody who claims that "squaw" isn't an offensive racial
slur in 21st century America is either a fool or a liar.
And FWIW I consider you to be truthful.

snip
The fact that you've been bamboozled by two liberals with an agenda is
just sad, the fact that you are belittling others who know better is
wrong.

You can argue the etymology until you're blue in the face.
It doesn't matter. Whether you like it or not the word is an
offensive racial slur and that, quite simply, is that. And
yes I do belittle those who use offensive racial slurs, it's
the least I can do.

--
Ken Fortenberry

In article ,
says...
wrote:
says...
Anybody who claims that "squaw" isn't an offensive racial
slur in 21st century America is either a fool or a liar.
And FWIW I consider you to be truthful.

snip
The fact that you've been bamboozled by two liberals with an agenda is
just sad, the fact that you are belittling others who know better is
wrong.

You can argue the etymology until you're blue in the face.
It doesn't matter. Whether you like it or not the word is an
offensive racial slur and that, quite simply, is that. And
yes I do belittle those who use offensive racial slurs, it's
the least I can do.

Saying it is because you say it is is far from compelling.
My squaw says hi.
- Ken

wrote:
says...
You can argue the etymology until you're blue in the face.
It doesn't matter. Whether you like it or not the word is an
offensive racial slur and that, quite simply, is that. And
yes I do belittle those who use offensive racial slurs, it's
the least I can do.

Saying it is because you say it is is far from compelling.
My squaw says hi.

Oh, it's not just me. Look it up anywhere you choose. You can
argue that it *shouldn't* be a racial slur, you can argue that
it became a racial slur in error, but you cannot argue that it
isn't a racial slur. And like I said, you and your wife are both
fools if you don't know that.

--
Ken Fortenberry

Ken Fortenberry wrote:
wrote:

Saying it is because you say it is is far from compelling.
My squaw says hi.

Oh, it's not just me. Look it up anywhere you choose. You can
argue that it *shouldn't* be a racial slur, you can argue that
it became a racial slur in error, but you cannot argue that it
isn't a racial slur. And like I said, you and your wife are both
fools if you don't know that.

These seemingly endless iterations back and forth here have a certain
hypnotic attraction, I'll admit, but perhaps I can just squeeze in to
add something to what 40 is saying.

I refer back to the article I posted earlier:

http://www.bend.com/news/ar_view.php?ar_id=24206

Now, as far as I can tell from talking to people here, there are two
reasons the local native peoples wanted these names changed. One is
that most of these places already *had* names before they were renamed
"Squaw," and the other is that the replacement name really *is*
inherently offensive to folks.

The way it's been explained to me by several people is that the folks
now living on the Warm Springs Reservation--like most western Indians--
really don't care about Algonquin words one way or the other; didn't
have any contact with Algonquins (until maybe 20th Century American
Indian Movement meetings, etc.), but they did have *lots* of contact
with settlers coming in who, in addition to taking all the best land,
had lots to say to Indians and about Indians.

Now, what folks remember is that most of what white settlers had to say
about them, and to them, (up until the last couple of decades, even) was
not particularly respectful, was in fact derogatory, dismissive,
jokingly condescending, etc. And among all this stuff were constant
references (*in English*, mind you) to "your squaw," "the squaws",
"those squaws over there", INSTEAD of just simply saying "your wife",
"the women", and "those women (or even gasp those ladies) over there.

So instead of simple, common English words and/or (imagine this!) the
*proper* words in Warm Springs, Paiute or Wasco, folks had to listen
over and over again to these obviously condescending, dismissive and
entirely foreign words, and not surprisingly they found the whole
business entirely offensive. The original etymology of the thing, for
them, has *nothing* whatever to do with it.

So, should I, when talking to someone from Warm Springs (which borders
on many spots I fish), dismiss their revulsion as modern PC
hand-wringing, or should I give them a lecture on the Algonquin roots of
the word, or should I simply avoid giving gratuitous offense?

JR