To stock or not to stock a wild trout stream. That is the question.

Peter A. Collin wrote:
Exactly what happened to the Battenkill to make it suddenly poor
fishing? Did they develop the banks and silt it in?

The river suffered a decline in mid-size fish in the mid-90s. Studies
were conducted and the river was made C&R for most of the main stem in
VT, to the NY State Line. In NY the river is stocked, BTW. Vermont have
not stocked since the 60s.

The state's studies concluded the issue was the lack of stream-side
habitat and this resulted in an absence of in-stream cover. I don't have
the number to hand, but it is surprising how many trout a dead-fall tree
trunk can incubate.

I recently re-read Merwin's "Battenkill". Written in 1992 before all
this went down, it is oddly prescient. In one chapter he invites us to
imagine the river 200 years. His description is of a slow moving stream
with lots of dead-fall and debris. Merwin identifies this as a key issue
for the river.

In the last 3 years the state has started to work with the landowners on
various projects in conjunction with funding from Orvis, TU and at least
one other interest groups.

Surveys of tributary streams reveal an astounding numbers of
young-of-the-year, so the basis is good, but the main river simply
cannot grow these fish.

My opinion is that they should fix the habitat issues and let the river
come back by itself. I don't think this opinion will prevail, so at best
it will have a neutral effect on the real problem.

GM wrote:
Peter A. Collin wrote:
Exactly what happened to the Battenkill to make it suddenly poor
fishing? Did they develop the banks and silt it in?

The river suffered a decline in mid-size fish in the mid-90s. Studies
were conducted and the river was made C&R for most of the main stem in
VT, to the NY State Line. In NY the river is stocked, BTW. Vermont have
not stocked since the 60s.

The state's studies concluded the issue was the lack of stream-side
habitat and this resulted in an absence of in-stream cover. I don't have
the number to hand, but it is surprising how many trout a dead-fall tree
trunk can incubate.

I recently re-read Merwin's "Battenkill". Written in 1992 before all
this went down, it is oddly prescient. In one chapter he invites us to
imagine the river 200 years. His description is of a slow moving stream
with lots of dead-fall and debris. Merwin identifies this as a key issue
for the river.

In the last 3 years the state has started to work with the landowners on
various projects in conjunction with funding from Orvis, TU and at least
one other interest groups.

Surveys of tributary streams reveal an astounding numbers of
young-of-the-year, so the basis is good, but the main river simply
cannot grow these fish.

My opinion is that they should fix the habitat issues and let the river
come back by itself. I don't think this opinion will prevail, so at best
it will have a neutral effect on the real problem.

It may be that stocking with catchables is exactly the right answer.
License fees and programs such as the habitat stamp in Colorado:

https://www1.wildlifelicense.com/co/

Will provide the funding and interest in this activity. Not everybody
recruited to the sport is a catch and release fly fisherman. Stocking
catchables promotes the sport to those who fish infrequently but want
to catch a few to eat (and otherwise would not buy a license or the
habitat contribution), especially the youth and inner city anglers.
It's a huge part of the equation in Colorado.

http://www.co.blm.gov/gjra/grandvalleyfishing.htm

Please consider the details of the very important role of put and take
stocking program in the 'holistic management strategy' for Colorado
(see goal of increased in put and take opportunities to 17.8% in the
fishing section of the overal strategy).

http://wildlife.state.co.us/NR/rdonl...0catchables%22

My personal feeling is that we (this group in particular) has a mental
'slide' that immediately relegates the word 'stocking' in to the
negative.

The fact is: Colorado fishing is excellent and getting better. Stocking
catchables is one of the diverse strategies for making it so. It's not
appropriate in all places, but I can tell you that places like St.
Vrain State Park, that is horrible habitat, provides exceptional
opportunity to catch and take home a few trout for dinner, and, despite
what you think, they are very good table fare.

So my advice remains:

Stock it and take a kid fishing. He (or she) will be the future that
protects fishing and will care about habitat.

Why not invite the Colorado Division of Wildlife to Vermont for a
management roundtable?

TBone
It is impossible to catch and release a wild trout.

wrote:


Why not invite the Colorado Division of Wildlife to Vermont for a
management roundtable?


Why don't you participate in the thread with something like a level of
sincerity? Why not read what people post and give it more than
millisecond of consideration. Why not look at the meaning of the word
"fix" versus "band-aid".

As far as I can tell the moniker "dumbass" fits well with you.

GM wrote:
wrote:


Why not invite the Colorado Division of Wildlife to Vermont for a
management roundtable?


Why don't you participate in the thread with something like a level of
sincerity? Why not read what people post and give it more than
millisecond of consideration. Why not look at the meaning of the word
"fix" versus "band-aid".

As far as I can tell the moniker "dumbass" fits well with you.

Why not invite the Colorado Division of Wildlife to Vermont for a
management roundtable?

Halfordian Golfer
A cash flow runs through it

wrote:
GM wrote:
wrote:


Why not invite the Colorado Division of Wildlife to Vermont for a
management roundtable?


Why don't you participate in the thread with something like a level of
sincerity? Why not read what people post and give it more than
millisecond of consideration. Why not look at the meaning of the word
"fix" versus "band-aid".

As far as I can tell the moniker "dumbass" fits well with you.

Why not invite the Colorado Division of Wildlife to Vermont for a
management roundtable?

Dumbass.

Halfordian Golfer
A cash flow runs through it

Moron.

Wolfgang

Wolfgang wrote:
wrote:
GM wrote:
wrote:


Why not invite the Colorado Division of Wildlife to Vermont for a
management roundtable?


Why don't you participate in the thread with something like a level of
sincerity? Why not read what people post and give it more than
millisecond of consideration. Why not look at the meaning of the word
"fix" versus "band-aid".

As far as I can tell the moniker "dumbass" fits well with you.

Why not invite the Colorado Division of Wildlife to Vermont for a
management roundtable?

Dumbass.

Halfordian Golfer
A cash flow runs through it

Moron.

Wolfgang

Wolfgang,

I would like to respectfully ask you to stop with the personal
invectives.

I'd also like to ask the question again:

Why not invite the Colorado Division of Wildlife to Vermont for a
multi-state fisheries management roundtable? Wouldn't it be possible
that a neutral party with a tremendous amount of experience bring a
positive influence with this decision? Wouldn't it be great to compare
strategic and tactical management plans taking the best from both
worlds? Isn't the free exchange of information important to the
resolution of any difficult multi-use decision such as this? I think
I'll propose it if the Vermont F&G return my inquiry.

Thank you,

Halfordian Golfer
Guilt replaced the creel

wrote:
Wolfgang wrote:
Dumbass.
...
Moron.

Wolfgang,

I would like to respectfully ask you to stop with the personal
invectives. ...

LOL !!

You're talking about the vast majority of Little Wolfie's
roff posts and 100% of his entertainment value.

Better to stick him in your bozo bin than to deprive the
rest of us our comedy.

--
Ken Fortenberry

wrote:



Wolfgang,

Yes?

I would like to respectfully ask you to stop with the personal
invectives.

Well then, go ahead and ask.

I'd also like to ask the question again:

Be my guest..

Why not invite the Colorado Division of Wildlife to Vermont for a
multi-state fisheries management roundtable?

Well, it's none of my business, really. Why don't YOU invite the
Colorado Division of Wildlife to Vermont for a multi-state fisheries
roundtable?

Wouldn't it be possible
that a neutral party with a tremendous amount of experience bring a
positive influence with this decision?

You flatter me. Anyway, as I already stated, it's really none of my
business.

Wouldn't it be great to compare
strategic and tactical management plans taking the best from both
worlds?

Couldn't say. I have no more idea of what laws, physical or otherwise,
pertain in your world than you do.

Isn't the free exchange of information important to the
resolution of any difficult multi-use decision such as this?

Isn't that what I've been telling you for the past several years? It
would do your position a world of good if you were first to find out
what it is......and then find some information and bring it to the
table........maybe. Frankly, what minuscule credibility you may once
have had before I became aware of your existence, you squandered a long
time ago.

I think

See, that's precisely the trouble.....you don't.

I'll propose it if the Vermont F&G return my inquiry.

Have fun.

Thank you,

Dumbass.

Halfordian Golfer

Do you even remember your name?

Guilt replaced the creel

You STILL haven't found anyone to explain the meaning of that cretinous
phrase to you?

Wolfgang